Re: Harbor Freight 1x30 Belt Sander August 14, 2014 08:29PM |
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Re: Harbor Freight 1x30 Belt Sander August 15, 2014 02:49AM |
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Re: Harbor Freight 1x30 Belt Sander August 15, 2014 03:46AM |
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DK
it will ruin the temper throughout the whole blade?
Re: Harbor Freight 1x30 Belt Sander August 15, 2014 04:07AM |
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Re: Harbor Freight 1x30 Belt Sander August 15, 2014 06:52AM |
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CliffStamp
As an aside a lot of people say to use some cheap knives first. I strongly suggest not doing that. That is a great way to pick up bad habits because you are not going to care about what you are doing and once you have sloppy grinding habits they will be extremely hard to break and you will go back to doing them by default.
Re: Harbor Freight 1x30 Belt Sander August 15, 2014 07:09AM |
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Chum
If you do this with an expensive knife... it becomes an expensive learning experience ...
Re: Harbor Freight 1x30 Belt Sander August 15, 2014 08:01AM |
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Re: Harbor Freight 1x30 Belt Sander August 15, 2014 08:42AM |
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Re: Harbor Freight 1x30 Belt Sander August 15, 2014 10:34AM |
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CliffStamp
... that correction is critical to development/learning. Studies into intuition/decision making have shown that correction is essential to learning/decision making and the most important things are :
-delay between action and correction
-force/impact of correction
This has broad range implications for all kinds of actions. There is a lot of focus on corrective punishments (in children as well as inmates) but it also is used in general training. It is why direct interaction has a much greater impact vs some kind of assignments with a huge delay in correction. There is too much of a delay and thus there is no rewiring of the response (in general).
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CliffStamp
Now some people are focused / goal driven so they can take a cheap butter knife and attempt to do crisp grinds and they are focused on the outcome and not the fact it is a $0 knife. However for most people they are almost guaranteed to scale down the importance of the correction and even in some cases ignore it.
Re: Harbor Freight 1x30 Belt Sander August 15, 2014 02:24PM |
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Re: Harbor Freight 1x30 Belt Sander August 15, 2014 03:01PM |
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Re: Harbor Freight 1x30 Belt Sander August 15, 2014 03:11PM |
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Re: Harbor Freight 1x30 Belt Sander August 15, 2014 03:28PM |
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Chum
Take a child who has never done any painting, put them in front of an easel, hold a gun to their parents and tell them... paint something with as much artistic value and showing as much traditional technique as the Mona Lisa, or we blow your parents away.
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After you have some of the basics covered, after you have successfully produced a nice regrind, THEN I think your "force/impact of correction" theory will have more merit.
Re: Harbor Freight 1x30 Belt Sander August 15, 2014 03:29PM |
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Chum
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Mark a
Ant regrind on a Medford would be an improvement so your entire argument is invalid.
What's an "ant regrind?" I used Medford as a joke reference you silly rabbit.
Re: Harbor Freight 1x30 Belt Sander August 15, 2014 04:37PM |
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Re: Harbor Freight 1x30 Belt Sander August 15, 2014 04:59PM |
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CliffStamp
That has a one time only correction and the goal isn't possible. The teacher is creating a situation where student will fail and they will see the consequence as unfair (because it can't be avoided) and it will have a negative impact on learning (plus create a psychotic break in the child).
If you view making a mistake on grinding a knife similar to your parents being shot and doing a regrind similar in skill/accomplishment as to creating one of the greatest pieces of art ever made - then maybe grinding knives isn't the thing for you.
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CliffStamp
Every time theory is used that sense, someplace, somewhere, Greg Medford smiles and baby jesus sheds a silent tear.
Re: Harbor Freight 1x30 Belt Sander August 15, 2014 05:48PM |
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Chum
I think it is silly to ...
Re: Harbor Freight 1x30 Belt Sander August 15, 2014 06:01PM |
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Re: Harbor Freight 1x30 Belt Sander August 15, 2014 06:02PM |
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Re: Harbor Freight 1x30 Belt Sander August 15, 2014 08:41PM |
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Re: Harbor Freight 1x30 Belt Sander August 15, 2014 10:52PM |
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Old Spice
The Mona Lisa is a bit overrated.
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Cliff Stamp
Again...
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Cliff Stamp
if the negative feedback is actually so strong that it prevents learning then the program is horribly designed because negative feedback should be extremely minimal (in frequency) compared to positive feedback.
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chad234
Right, like ruining your best knife by toying around with a grinder.....
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Cliff Stamp
When I started studying quantum mechanics I thought it was absurd, I still do, doesn't make what is said about it any less true.
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Cliff Stamp
I further explained why this enhances learning, and why using inexpensive knives you don't care about...
Re: Harbor Freight 1x30 Belt Sander August 16, 2014 03:39AM |
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Re: Harbor Freight 1x30 Belt Sander August 16, 2014 04:45AM |
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Re: Harbor Freight 1x30 Belt Sander August 16, 2014 06:40AM |
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Re: Harbor Freight 1x30 Belt Sander August 16, 2014 07:50AM |
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Re: Harbor Freight 1x30 Belt Sander August 16, 2014 08:23AM |
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Mark a
I remember when I was learning to drive I took lessons and I was a bit older 18 instead of 16. When it came time to parallel park the instructor had me do it in between two expensive cars, a jaguar and I think it was a bmw maybe a Mercedes. And at the time I felt the incentive to get it right was very high.
Re: Harbor Freight 1x30 Belt Sander August 16, 2014 08:42AM |
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Re: Harbor Freight 1x30 Belt Sander August 16, 2014 08:57AM |
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Chum
Explaining how you used to not understand something, and still don't understand that same thing even after studying it, in no way strengthens your argument.
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chad234
Where I think Cliff's theory falls, as Chum has pointed, is that it ignores that learning to grind is not just avoiding "bad habits", it is about learning good ones.
Re: Harbor Freight 1x30 Belt Sander August 16, 2014 09:02AM |
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Re: Harbor Freight 1x30 Belt Sander August 16, 2014 09:25AM |
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CliffStamp
My point was that simply because something seems silly doesn't mean anything and isn't an argument for something not being true.
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CliffStamp
This is why it took so long for QM to be accepted,