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Electric Sharpener vs Whetstones - Best $150 Spent

Posted by CliffStamp 
Electric Sharpener vs Whetstones - Best $150 Spent
July 02, 2020 09:33AM
Video :

[www.youtube.com]

This is one of the better comparison videos I have seen :

-he notes the limits of his comparison
-the comparison really doesn't favor the benchstones even though he sells them

In some detail, it takes him 50% longer to sharpen a knife vs the machine, and it was his first time using the machine so he would only get faster, and he has a lot of experience sharpening on benchstones. More surprising there isn't a difference in sharpness from the machine to a benchstone of similar grit.

An interesting question would be :

-is there any benefit to edge retention from the benchstones
-is there any difference to the lifetime of the knife
-does the sharpener change the geometry of the knife if you use it significantly (I suspect it would in the heel)
Re: Electric Sharpener vs Whetstones - Best $150 Spent
July 02, 2020 03:59PM
5 minutes for electric, 6:50 for stones. That is a lot of time to spend sharpening.
Re: Electric Sharpener vs Whetstones - Best $150 Spent
July 02, 2020 05:08PM
Quote
Old Spice
That is a lot of time to spend sharpening.

30 to 60 mins isn't unheard of on YT watching people who make sharpening video's, in comparison Buffection is lightning fast. If you listen to him, he talks about how he likes sharpening. A lot of the people who sharpen do it as a thing for itself.

His time on the machine was so long as he was trying to figure out how to do it, all you have to do is just pull the blade through, 1-2 mins max, even if you are a novice would be all that is needed.
Re: Electric Sharpener vs Whetstones - Best $150 Spent
July 02, 2020 05:10PM
I just spent over an hour using six Sigma II Select stones: 250, 400, 1200, 3000, 6000, 10,000 on the clone of an Edge Pro Apex, to get a mirrored edge. It didn't get any sharper than a knife I sharpen if a few minutes.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Gotta love living in 2019 baby, (63rc too soft on a production knife)"
--Shawn Houston
__
"I am still discussing issues of steels and performance at this stage."
--Cliff Stamp
__
"Cause geometry cuts, .....steel determines the level and the duration"
--Roman Landes
__
"But in general, I'm all about high performance, Ergos, safety. That's why I've been accused of 'designing in the dark' "
--Sal Glesser
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
StoneSharpEdges

Jason D. Stone on YouTube
cKc
Re: Electric Sharpener vs Whetstones - Best $150 Spent
July 03, 2020 07:16AM
Quote
jasonstone20
I just spent over an hour using six Sigma II Select stones: 250, 400, 1200, 3000, 6000, 10,000 on the clone of an Edge Pro Apex, to get a mirrored edge. It didn't get any sharper than a knife I sharpen if a few minutes.
But you did it anyway. lol

----------------------------------------------------------------------
It's not Cliff, its Dr Stamp
#kebabstickcut, it's a thing - make it happen
Re: Electric Sharpener vs Whetstones - Best $150 Spent
July 03, 2020 08:42AM
cKc,
Yes, I did, lol. I am testing out a set of stones, and they are cut to be used in an Edge Pro.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Gotta love living in 2019 baby, (63rc too soft on a production knife)"
--Shawn Houston
__
"I am still discussing issues of steels and performance at this stage."
--Cliff Stamp
__
"Cause geometry cuts, .....steel determines the level and the duration"
--Roman Landes
__
"But in general, I'm all about high performance, Ergos, safety. That's why I've been accused of 'designing in the dark' "
--Sal Glesser
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
StoneSharpEdges

Jason D. Stone on YouTube
Re: Electric Sharpener vs Whetstones - Best $150 Spent
July 03, 2020 09:52AM
I saw that one a a while back. It’s pretty interesting.

I have seen, Cliff, knives from people who use those electric sharpeners on a regular basis and there is almost always a strong recurve near the heel after a while. I have no clue about the overall lifetime of a knife sharpened on one vs. a bench stone, however.
Re: Electric Sharpener vs Whetstones - Best $150 Spent
July 03, 2020 07:37PM
Yeah Ryky over at Burrfection is a really great guy, and ultimately the reason I got into sharpening recently as a full fledged hobby of its own. I actually support him on Patreon now as well.

That video was actually the exact one I saw first, and I watched more of his channel because I was so impressed by how even-handedly he approached evaluating an electric sharpening machine despite his obvious bias as a user and seller of wherstones. That really struck me as uncommon integrity and piqued my interest. (Side note, but Burrfection is also responsible indirectly for my finding Cliff; Ryky infamously sharpens knives on a brick and that led me to Cliff’s brick video.)

He’s scrupulously honest about the limits of his knowledge and his biases, and pretty fair in reviews as evidenced by that video. I’ve learned a lot more functional information about sharpening and steels from the folks here and other videos on youtube, but Ryky / Burrfecrtion’s enthusiasm, generosity, humility, and ability to find joy in the process inspires me on a different level.

Cliff, you should check out his first look video of the Wicked Edge system. I think you might find it interesting also.

video: [www.youtube.com]

-----

-Jay



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/03/2020 07:39PM by jloden.
Re: Electric Sharpener vs Whetstones - Best $150 Spent
July 03, 2020 07:54PM
Does he talk about that after more extensive use?
Re: Electric Sharpener vs Whetstones - Best $150 Spent
July 05, 2020 09:20AM
Quote
CliffStamp
Does he talk about that after more extensive use?

Not yet that I’ve seen. It may be that he hasn’t come back around to it since, but to his credit Ryky also takes his time before reviews, like using a knife for months in his own kitchen before talking about it in depth. If he ends up posting more about it I’m definitely curious to see what he has to say.

-----

-Jay
Re: Electric Sharpener vs Whetstones - Best $150 Spent
July 05, 2020 10:10AM
My main issue with all of those jig systems is that there is no burr removal easily because they are all set to grind at an exact angle, and they do burr removal just by going to higher and higher grits until you never remove it, just minimize it. Now of course you can just adjust the edge angle:

-sharpen at 15
-burr removal/apex at 20 (or whatever needed)
-back sharpen at 15, if needed

It is just clunky, and their default setup of diamonds is prone to heavy burr removal and also generating a LOT of magnetized dust so maybe don't do that around any computers.
Re: Electric Sharpener vs Whetstones - Best $150 Spent
July 09, 2020 05:39AM
Quote
CliffStamp
My main issue with all of those jig systems is that there is no burr removal easily because they are all set to grind at an exact angle, and they do burr removal just by going to higher and higher grits until you never remove it, just minimize it. Now of course you can just adjust the edge angle:

-sharpen at 15
-burr removal/apex at 20 (or whatever needed)
-back sharpen at 15, if needed

It is just clunky, and their default setup of diamonds is prone to heavy burr removal and also generating a LOT of magnetized dust so maybe don't do that around any computers.

Interesting. I've never used one though I was very interested in getting a Wicked Edge for a while as the precise angle control was appealing. In the end I decided I wouldn't be happy sharpening unless I conquered freehand anyway so I put that idea to the side for a while and stuck with bench stones.

The majority of people use the strops kit with the Wicked Edge, or at least finish on a strop by hand. Presumably that would help remove any fine burr remaining? I think I remember seeing a thread where you actually tried a W.E. system including the strops; did you encounter a burr with it even after that step?

-----

-Jay
Re: Electric Sharpener vs Whetstones - Best $150 Spent
July 09, 2020 08:35AM
I tried a WE for awhile, at some point I will try it again, but the above is based on my experience with it. I do find it ironic to use an extremely expensive jigged system and then strop by hand. Sharpening only consists of two things :

-set the edge
-set the apex

Amusingly enough, it is the last step that they are doing by hand on the strop which requires the most precise angle control.
Re: Electric Sharpener vs Whetstones - Best $150 Spent
July 09, 2020 09:51AM
Cliff,
The Wicked Edge and a few other of the fixured systems now have stropping stones/paddles that you can use with the system. The instructions are to change the angle slightly, either raise or lower it, I can't remember. I will see if I can find a YouTube video of it.

Found it:
[www.youtube.com]

[support.wickededgeusa.com]

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Gotta love living in 2019 baby, (63rc too soft on a production knife)"
--Shawn Houston
__
"I am still discussing issues of steels and performance at this stage."
--Cliff Stamp
__
"Cause geometry cuts, .....steel determines the level and the duration"
--Roman Landes
__
"But in general, I'm all about high performance, Ergos, safety. That's why I've been accused of 'designing in the dark' "
--Sal Glesser
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
StoneSharpEdges

Jason D. Stone on YouTube
Re: Electric Sharpener vs Whetstones - Best $150 Spent
July 09, 2020 10:30AM
Quote
CliffStamp
I tried a WE for awhile, at some point I will try it again, but the above is based on my experience with it. I do find it ironic to use an extremely expensive jigged system and then strop by hand. Sharpening only consists of two things :

-set the edge
-set the apex

Amusingly enough, it is the last step that they are doing by hand on the strop which requires the most precise angle control.

Funny thing to me is that when I started to get seriously interested again in taking up sharpening as a hobby, I was looking exclusively at jig systems originally. I took up freehand sharpening first essentially just to satisfy myself that I could acquire enough skill get a sharp edge off a stone by hand before I moved on to a jig that did all the angle holding for me.

Instead, now that I've gotten much farther along the learning curve I'm starting to really recognize significant advantages to freehand sharpening especially in flexibility. And of course I'm definitely enjoying it in its own right. But it's also taken me months of practice, reading, and research to get there.

Definitely an appeal to electric sharpeners and jig-based systems for people that want to maintain their knives and either are intimidated by or just uninterested in acquiring a new skill like freehand sharpening. It's an interesting question what's the most cost effective route in that case. For me it was no contest to spend the money on whetstones but I was specifically looking for that challenge. For someone else that just wants to cut tomatoes in the kitchen cleanly that equation balances differently.

Something the folks on this forum really opened my eyes to is the value proposition in a simple, cheap oil stone. The case for cost effectiveness of freehand sharpening shifts pretty radically when you're talking about a $20 Norton Crystolon or India combo stone instead of $150+ worth of waterstones. I've been using a C/F Crystolon in the kitchen lately to touch up the cheap knives and I've been really pleased with it. I've previously recommended Lansky crock stick systems to non-knife people I know that want to maintain kitchen knives as a low cost, low barrier-of-entry system. But it's best for maintenance on an edge or microbevel whereas a Crystolon coarse will happily reprofile a knife or reset an edge bevel.

-----

-Jay
Re: Electric Sharpener vs Whetstones - Best $150 Spent
July 09, 2020 12:31PM
jloden,
In my experirence, learning to sharpen on a system vs freehand takes the same amount of time and effort, except maybe the Spyderco Sharpmaker and other V-stick type sharpeners, and they also have a learning curve

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Gotta love living in 2019 baby, (63rc too soft on a production knife)"
--Shawn Houston
__
"I am still discussing issues of steels and performance at this stage."
--Cliff Stamp
__
"Cause geometry cuts, .....steel determines the level and the duration"
--Roman Landes
__
"But in general, I'm all about high performance, Ergos, safety. That's why I've been accused of 'designing in the dark' "
--Sal Glesser
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
StoneSharpEdges

Jason D. Stone on YouTube
Re: Electric Sharpener vs Whetstones - Best $150 Spent
July 09, 2020 02:07PM
Yes, I am aware of the stropping paddles, I have them. However not everyone wants a fully polished stropped finish. In a lot of cases that is not the ideal edge for cutting ability or edge retention.
Re: Electric Sharpener vs Whetstones - Best $150 Spent
July 09, 2020 03:17PM
Cliff,
Can they be used with a more coarse finish, and still retain the desired coarse finish? I am really not that big on stropping either, I am not totally against it but I think you can do almost everything with the stones. I think the way you came up with minimizing the burr until it no longer is detectable is a good way to get rid of the burr. I played around with using your 3-Step Sharpening method with fixtured systems, what I found easiest to do was just increase the angle by one or two steps on the angle setting. This isn't easy to do on a system that has infinite adjustment like the Edge Pro Apex, the KME, and others. I really don't find any advantage to fixtured systems except for making super high polished V edges that are mainly for show.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Gotta love living in 2019 baby, (63rc too soft on a production knife)"
--Shawn Houston
__
"I am still discussing issues of steels and performance at this stage."
--Cliff Stamp
__
"Cause geometry cuts, .....steel determines the level and the duration"
--Roman Landes
__
"But in general, I'm all about high performance, Ergos, safety. That's why I've been accused of 'designing in the dark' "
--Sal Glesser
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
StoneSharpEdges

Jason D. Stone on YouTube
Re: Electric Sharpener vs Whetstones - Best $150 Spent
July 09, 2020 03:39PM
Cliff,
I just remembered something about the issue that the deep scratches were suppose to cause. Supposedly the make sharpening take longer, because you have to remove more metal while going from scratch pattern to scratch pattern, and that takes longer and wears out the knife. It also lets the carbides fall out easier and makes possible stress fracture points that can fail. I don't think this is an actual issue, but I don't sell the stones either. I also might be remembering the deep scratch issue wrong also. I will see if I can find a reference. A lot of this stuff is just knife sharpener myth and lore, like how knife makers pass on information that isn't correct sometimes.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Gotta love living in 2019 baby, (63rc too soft on a production knife)"
--Shawn Houston
__
"I am still discussing issues of steels and performance at this stage."
--Cliff Stamp
__
"Cause geometry cuts, .....steel determines the level and the duration"
--Roman Landes
__
"But in general, I'm all about high performance, Ergos, safety. That's why I've been accused of 'designing in the dark' "
--Sal Glesser
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
StoneSharpEdges

Jason D. Stone on YouTube
Re: Electric Sharpener vs Whetstones - Best $150 Spent
July 09, 2020 04:54PM
Versus 'regular' waterstones.
Ok the benefits of the stone:
Leaves a 'crisper' edge than AlO waterstones, cuts the carbides. I think he is meaning a tree-topping edge vs just a shaving sharp edge.
You can sharpen steels like S110V.

Disadvantages:
They load fairly quickly.
They feedback is better than coated diamond stones, but worse than 'regular' waterstones.
Price. Everything but the Venev and DMD stones are about two to ten times the price.
You have to be a good sharpener in the first place.
A cleaning stone is needed.
They don't cut fast.

[www.youtube.com]




------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Gotta love living in 2019 baby, (63rc too soft on a production knife)"
--Shawn Houston
__
"I am still discussing issues of steels and performance at this stage."
--Cliff Stamp
__
"Cause geometry cuts, .....steel determines the level and the duration"
--Roman Landes
__
"But in general, I'm all about high performance, Ergos, safety. That's why I've been accused of 'designing in the dark' "
--Sal Glesser
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
StoneSharpEdges

Jason D. Stone on YouTube
cKc
Re: Electric Sharpener vs Whetstones - Best $150 Spent
July 09, 2020 08:22PM
Quote
jasonstone20
Cliff,
I just remembered something about the issue that the deep scratches were suppose to cause. Supposedly the make sharpening take longer, because you have to remove more metal while going from scratch pattern to scratch pattern, and that takes longer and wears out the knife.

This would be the stupidest claim I've ever heard.

if they take too long and take off too much metal, then you were using too coarse a grit in the maintenance sharpening.

if I drive the highway at 100mph, and then say.. i was going too fast in that car, lets put a speed limiter on it to 80mph and make it slower.. is that better than just driving at 80mph when I want to?

look at this image and pretend its 60grit and 120grit mesh.. do you really think its advantageous to take 60grit mesh fill it with binder to the blue line so you have tiny little pieces spaced out wide that can only cut 120 grit deep? vs the large array of actual 120grit you get on a 120grit mesh?


All you are doing is leaving a lot more spaced smaller scratches in random locations requiring a shit load more effort and time than if you just used a 120grit with full coverage.

GRIT = GOUGE.. that's what grinding is.. anything that reduced the gouging for a specified grit is bad.. just get a finer grit that is optimal in its mesh size.

no wonder it takes these people so long to do things.. they are crippling themselves.

----------------------------------------------------------------------
It's not Cliff, its Dr Stamp
#kebabstickcut, it's a thing - make it happen
Re: Electric Sharpener vs Whetstones - Best $150 Spent
July 09, 2020 09:00PM
cKc,
Yeah, I think often these are solutions in search for a problem, or more fitting a product in search for a use. I should have the set of Venev OCB stones soon so I will be able to compare them to the Sigma II Selects, which are both the same size at 1"x6". I think the whole thing is sharpening woo, not based in reality but sounds good to the uninformed and inexperienced. The only reasons I liked the Venev OCB stones was the polish and the fact they can go up to and past 3u to 1u.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Gotta love living in 2019 baby, (63rc too soft on a production knife)"
--Shawn Houston
__
"I am still discussing issues of steels and performance at this stage."
--Cliff Stamp
__
"Cause geometry cuts, .....steel determines the level and the duration"
--Roman Landes
__
"But in general, I'm all about high performance, Ergos, safety. That's why I've been accused of 'designing in the dark' "
--Sal Glesser
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
StoneSharpEdges

Jason D. Stone on YouTube
Re: Electric Sharpener vs Whetstones - Best $150 Spent
July 09, 2020 09:48PM
All that kind of stuff is, just like the nonsensical claims that Gaston makes, is armchair hypothesizing. People sit around and think about stuff, and if an idea “sounds good” for whatever reason, they go with it.

Plenty of people will be completely convinced of something as long as it sounds complicated, uses a few big or technical words, and is stated with some conviction and confidence.
Re: Electric Sharpener vs Whetstones - Best $150 Spent
July 10, 2020 06:05AM
As a note :

"One example of a recent bond development for precision grinding wheels is Norton Vitrium bond. Designed to be stronger than conventional vitrified bonds, Vitrium bonded products are capable of higher operating speed ratings and have a lower overall bond content for a given degree of abrasive holding power. This reduces the amount of bond-on-part rubbing and, in turn, lowers the energy which goes into the part during grinding and, subsequently, the likelihood of burn. This concept is shown schematically in Figure 2. The lower bond content of Vitrium products, coupled with the increased speed rating capability, enables significantly higher material removal rates and reduced cycle times compared to standard bonded grinding wheels. Figure 3 shows a plot of power versus material removal rate generated during finish grinding of case-hardened 8620 steel at different feed rates. It can be seen that the effective material removal rate can be approximately doubled with the Vitrium grinding specification while maintaining part quality in terms of achieving the required surface roughness (Ra) value and avoiding part burn."

[www.nortonabrasives.com]

The lower amount of bond is a positive thing.

I have to give the guys credit though, they are able to sell a weakness of the stones (the shallower grit due to the weaker bond) and promote it as a disadvantage of their competition.
Re: Electric Sharpener vs Whetstones - Best $150 Spent
July 10, 2020 08:05AM
Quote
jasonstone20

They feedback is better than coated diamond stones, but worse than 'regular' waterstones.

I still don't know what people mean when they say the feedback of the stone, and everyone I ask either can't explain it, or what they say makes little sense. They also never talk about the influence of the steel which makes little sense, as an India stone cutting 420J2 is nothing like the same stone with 10V at 65 HRC.
Re: Electric Sharpener vs Whetstones - Best $150 Spent
July 10, 2020 10:04AM
Cliff,
It is a subjective thing, that is why. It refers to how the knife feels on the stone, how easily you can tell if you are sharpening on, below, or above the apex, and how close you are to apexing the knife.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Gotta love living in 2019 baby, (63rc too soft on a production knife)"
--Shawn Houston
__
"I am still discussing issues of steels and performance at this stage."
--Cliff Stamp
__
"Cause geometry cuts, .....steel determines the level and the duration"
--Roman Landes
__
"But in general, I'm all about high performance, Ergos, safety. That's why I've been accused of 'designing in the dark' "
--Sal Glesser
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
StoneSharpEdges

Jason D. Stone on YouTube
cKc
Re: Electric Sharpener vs Whetstones - Best $150 Spent
July 10, 2020 10:16AM
Quote
jasonstone20
Cliff,
It is a subjective thing, that is why. It refers to how the knife feels on the stone, how easily you can tell if you are sharpening on, below, or above the apex, and how close you are to apexing the knife.

so if its subjective it has little value from a review perspective as the person talking about feedback, unless they describe in detail what the feedback they are talking about means, doesn't tell anyone else anything


kind of like knife reviewers who take a knife out of the brand new box and tell me its the best knife they used that week

----------------------------------------------------------------------
It's not Cliff, its Dr Stamp
#kebabstickcut, it's a thing - make it happen
Re: Electric Sharpener vs Whetstones - Best $150 Spent
July 10, 2020 10:22AM
Quote
jasonstone20
It is a subjective thing, that is why. It refers to how the knife feels on the stone, how easily you can tell if you are sharpening on, below, or above the apex, and how close you are to apexing the knife.

If it’s entirely subjective, then how could you gauge what the knife is doing based on it?

Also, I think it’s outright nonsense that a person can tell by feel alone how close it is to being apexed. There’s just no plausible way to have that much sensitivity, that’s why things like checking sharpness on fine papers and looking for light reflection are used.
Re: Electric Sharpener vs Whetstones - Best $150 Spent
July 10, 2020 11:13AM
That is what seems to be the case because people use adjectives to describe it which are pleasure-related. I don't want to know how much fun you are having using an abrasive, I want to know how it works. This is why I say it seems like now in abrasives we are where we were to in the 70's on steels, it is all myth and magic.

Imagine asking a mechanic about sandpaper and him talking about it the same way these stones are being described :

"The feedback on the Naniwa Professional line up is, in my opinion, absolutely delightful, in fact the 400 and 1,000 grit offer fantastic feedback and while the 5,000 grit stone does feel harder, it still feels completely acceptable."

This is from a seller, now what am I supposed to get from that? How is that an evaluation of a grinding abrasive?

I want to know things like :

-what pressure causes the slurry to generate
-does the abrasive fracture or does the bond fracture
-what type of slurry is formed
-what lubricant is necessary to keep friction down and minimize abrasive wear

other questions related to grinding.
Re: Electric Sharpener vs Whetstones - Best $150 Spent
July 10, 2020 11:55AM
Quote
cKc

so if its subjective it has little value from a review perspective as the person talking about feedback, unless they describe in detail what the feedback they are talking about means, doesn't tell anyone else anything

Exaclty

Quote
Ryan Nafe

Also, I think it’s outright nonsense that a person can tell by feel alone how close it is to being apexed. There’s just no plausible way to have that much sensitivity, that’s why things like checking sharpness on fine papers and looking for light reflection are used.

It isn't, I do it all the time: [www.youtube.com]

I haven't sharpened that knife in at least a year, if not more. It was at the bottom of my knife bin. But I could tell easily when to stop before the edge became overground and formed a burr. You can even hear the difference on the stone. It is easier to do on Japanese waterstones vs diamond plates, because they offer more sensory clues.

Quote
Cliff Stamp
That is what seems to be the case because people use adjectives to describe it which are pleasure-related. I don't want to know how much fun you are having using an abrasive, I want to know how it works. This is why I say it seems like now in abrasives we are where we were to in the 70's on steels, it is all myth and magic.

Exactly, that is why I say it is a luxury, and stones that supposedly have 'good feedback' vs ones that don't, and they both work the same, it is a luxury, a individual preference. It isn't needed to get the job done.

Quote
Cliff Stamp

I want to know things like :

-what pressure causes the slurry to generate
-does the abrasive fracture or does the bond fracture
-what type of slurry is formed
-what lubricant is necessary to keep friction down and minimize abrasive wear

other questions related to grinding.

I would like to know these things also, because these are actual relevant questions, not a bunch of feely, woo-woo, sharpening adjectives and metaphors. Now I have a Japanese Natural stone that feels like you are sharpening on a bed of ball bearings, and one that feels like a frozen chocolate bar. But that tells me absolutely nothing important about the stone in use. It is just a bunch of flowery language for people who have a deep interest in these types of stones, but there is zero practicality about it.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Gotta love living in 2019 baby, (63rc too soft on a production knife)"
--Shawn Houston
__
"I am still discussing issues of steels and performance at this stage."
--Cliff Stamp
__
"Cause geometry cuts, .....steel determines the level and the duration"
--Roman Landes
__
"But in general, I'm all about high performance, Ergos, safety. That's why I've been accused of 'designing in the dark' "
--Sal Glesser
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
StoneSharpEdges

Jason D. Stone on YouTube



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 07/10/2020 11:58AM by jasonstone20.
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