Welcome! Log In Create A New Profile

Advanced

Using a smooth tungsten carbide rod as a steeling tool

Posted by bricklayer 
This forum is currently read only. You can not log in or make any changes. This is a temporary situation.
Using a smooth tungsten carbide rod as a steeling tool
December 31, 2017 01:34AM
This idea of using tungsten as a steel has always peaked my interest. There's alot of tungsten pull through gadgets on the market as sharpeners, but they normally have a sharp angled corner resulting in removing to much metal. I was wondering if a totally smooth round carbide blank would be to aggressive on a knife? Meaning making the edge wavy and causing premature wear, if i use one to do a couple of light steeling passes every so often.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/31/2017 01:35AM by bricklayer.
Re: Using a smooth tungsten carbide rod as a steeling tool
December 31, 2017 02:49AM
The ones with the corners are fine, just don't press hard.

Kyley used to make nitrided rods, they work very well for the same purposes.
Re: Using a smooth tungsten carbide rod as a steeling tool
December 31, 2017 02:58AM
Quote
CliffStamp
The ones with the corners are fine, just don't press hard.

Kyley used to make nitrided rods, they work very well for the same purposes.
If i use a smooth tungsten rod will the knife edge steel bite into the tungsten or just slide on it like on a traditional honing smooth steel?
Re: Using a smooth tungsten carbide rod as a steeling tool
December 31, 2017 02:36PM
Pure tungsten isn't really hard enough, you want tungsten carbide. Typically pure tungsten and tungsten alloys are going be Rockwell 40c and under from the material data I've looked at. With a Moh's hardness of 7.5.
Re: Using a smooth tungsten carbide rod as a steeling tool
December 31, 2017 03:03PM
What is the perceived benefit of using a tungsten carbide rod vs. a hardened steel rod?
I know, answering a question with a question,........ but I'm curious.

I was under the assumption that anything harder than the knife could be used as a steel?
I rarely use a steel so I'm not well versed in their nuances.

I do have a few pieces of hardened H12 rod that lived its former life as a ejector pins in a plastic injection molds.
I use it occasionally as a burr tester.
When I did more home butchering it saw a little more use. It's faster to do a quick steel job than to clean up well enough to use a stone.
Also I found when butchering my hands were wet and cold, so burr detection is almost impossible for me. So instead of trying to get rid of it I would just stand it back up temporarily.
Re: Using a smooth tungsten carbide rod as a steeling tool
December 31, 2017 05:45PM
Quote
bricklayer

If i use a smooth tungsten rod will the knife edge steel bite into the tungsten or just slide on it like on a traditional honing smooth steel?

When you see things called tungsten or titanium, like titanium drill bits, they are not actually titanium or tungsten, but just contain it. A tungsten rod is likely tungsten carbide, titanium coatings are generally titanium nitride.

Nerd-fact aside, tungsten carbide is harder than steel, and harder than most carbide in steel. If you use it on very high vanadium steels you will note that the rod does get scratched/worn (but ultra-slowly) and it will still align the edge (which is mainly steel).

If you use the same rod on something crazy like 121REX I don't think you would get nice results as those steels are high in carbide which makes them tend to not respond well to reforming, the apex is likely to just chip out with repeated burnishing. However if you are using the knife like a saw, this could be of benefit actually, so maybe you would like it.

I would be curious to see the effects on the rod as such steels are decently high in carbides which are harder than the rod used to burnish.
Re: Using a smooth tungsten carbide rod as a steeling tool
December 31, 2017 05:46PM
Quote
J.Pierce
What is the perceived benefit of using a tungsten carbide rod vs. a hardened steel rod?

It is possible you can get adhesive wear of steel on steel, so you could pull off bits of the apex. This won't happen with tungsten nearly as much and so you get more of a pure burnishing effect.
Re: Using a smooth tungsten carbide rod as a steeling tool
December 31, 2017 06:00PM
It sounds interesting to me. Would it be more expensive? How would the tungsten carbide rod compare against Kylie's nitrided rod? I always wanted to try one of those nitrided rods out. Are they effective on S30V?

"I am still discussing issues of steels and performance at this stage." -- Cliff Stamp, May his memory be a blessing
"Life is GOOD", -- Stefan_Wolf, May His Memory Be A Blessing
WordPress YouTube Facebook Patreon Locals Instagram Twitter
Re: Using a smooth tungsten carbide rod as a steeling tool
December 31, 2017 10:16PM
Id be interested to know also how the nitrided rods compare against a tungsten carbide blank.Are those nitrided rods still available? I do know pricing a pure tungsten carbide blank is pretty pricy. So if a nitrided rod would be equally i might go that route.
Re: Using a smooth tungsten carbide rod as a steeling tool
December 31, 2017 11:14PM
bricklayer,
That is exaclty what I was thinking.

"I am still discussing issues of steels and performance at this stage." -- Cliff Stamp, May his memory be a blessing
"Life is GOOD", -- Stefan_Wolf, May His Memory Be A Blessing
WordPress YouTube Facebook Patreon Locals Instagram Twitter
Re: Using a smooth tungsten carbide rod as a steeling tool
January 02, 2018 07:53PM
Unless you are using a very high nitrided steel (and there are some), I can't see of any significant difference. I don't have any data on it however.
Re: Using a smooth tungsten carbide rod as a steeling tool
January 02, 2018 11:21PM
Were the tungsten rods you saw solid or coated?

I was assuming coated.
I've only ran into tungsten coated components.Cam followers and hot forging dies, cylinder linings, stuff like that.
I know there are different types of coatings too, cobalt and nickel chrome tungsten alloys, or some such combinations.
I haven't had much dealing with it, so not a lot of knowledge about it.

But my whole rambling point is. maybe a coated rod component from something might be much more economical than trying to find solid stock.